Empowering Sales and Managing Stress in Hospitality | with Eric Szymanski

The Modern Hotelier #63: Empowering Sales and Managing Stress in Hospitality | with Eric Szymanski === Steve Carran [00:00:41]: We are really excited to release this episode with Eric Simanski from Amadeus. David, what were some of your favorite takeaways from our conversation? David Millili [00:00:50]: Well, I thought it was great how, Eric, his background, especially, you know, as you meet in the industry, people who've worked for Disney, how that's really shaped them and and kinda push them to certain standards and just his, you know, I think commitment to helping others and understanding the stress side of it and and how difficult sales can be. So I think this is this is a good one for everybody, but I think sales people really appreciate this episode. Steve Carran [00:01:15]: Absolutely. And, you know, coming from the sales side, I appreciated his aspect or his, his point of view from, you know, being on the hotel side. Now he's working for Amadeus. So kind of seeing how that correlated and like you said, the mental health aspect that he focuses on and not only that, but also empowering your team. It just was a great episode for not only if you're in sales, but, you know, anybody that works with sales or marketing or anything like that. So, some great knowledge in this one, and I'm excited to have everybody listen to this one. So David Millili [00:01:46]: Alright. Enjoy the episode. Steve Carran [00:02:31]: Today, we have on Eric Simanski, the director of sales on the business intelligence side at Amadeus. Eric is an award winning hospitality professional with extensive sales and marketing leadership experience including brands like Hilton, Marriott, Starwood, and Disney. Eric is also a co founder of a book called Sell More, Stress Less, 52 Tips to Become a Mindful Sales Professional. Welcome to the show, Eric. David Millili [00:03:02]: Good. So, Eric, we're gonna go through a quick kinda lightning round, find out about your your background, get into your career, then jump into some ministry topics. Sound good? Eric [00:03:13]: That sounds amazing. Thank you. David Millili [00:03:14]: Alright. Great. So what was your first job? Eric [00:03:17]: In the hotel business, I was a server at the Peabody Orlando before it was converted to a Hyatt, but, you know, you think about all the service level training at the frontline when you're a server in college trying to really make an impression so you can earn great tips. And it just, was amazing how I I use skills even that I learned back then today. David Millili [00:03:42]: That's great. So what's your favorite city? Eric [00:03:44]: Nashville, Tennessee. I live in Denver, spent my career in thank you, gentlemen. How are you today? And anytime you have a chance to go and just find at your next doorstep the right band. If you don't like the one you're in, go to the next one. Run a lot of marathons there with the rock and roll races. And this time of year, as we're coming into spring and it's warming up, it's just a great city to be in. David Millili [00:04:09]: Joyce, what's the best piece of advice you've received? Eric [00:04:12]: This one is, let's save my sanity as a director of sales and marketing. No tree grows to the sky. This was delivered by Bill Marriott junior at a sales and revenue management conference. And I was really struggling with how I was gonna set a budget for my owner. And, his his story was to his entire team, you know, you can't really have double digit growth forever. There's gonna be corrections in the market. And if you find your ownership group is pushing you a little too hard for that double digit every single year. Make sure that you you set some realistic expectations. Eric [00:04:49]: And frankly, that was just a huge relief to me. And I actually wondered why he shared that advice because I'm like, you shouldn't really be telling us that. We're all revenue leaders. We need to go for the gusto. Right? But it's just, let's be real and and let's make sure that we understand the budget is always wrong. So if you're obsessing about it, your job is to manage to it, not to, you know, just throw some number up against the wall that's super high all the time. David Millili [00:05:16]: That's great. Good advice. If you could trade places with anyone for a day, who would you trade places with? Eric [00:05:22]: You know, in our business, in the hotel world, it's amazing to see the leaders that are on stage. Gosh. You know? Who would we wanna be if we could really make a huge difference in this world? How about Warren Buffett? Let's just go there. Straight to the top. David Millili [00:05:39]: That's great. What's on your bucket list? Eric [00:05:42]: I love this industry. I love traveling. I love staying in hotels, resorts, alternative accommodations, getting on airplanes, you know, driving in cars, going skiing. Right now, I've had the pleasure of touring most of the United States, North America, Canada, the Caribbean, Mexico, and I really have to just keep traveling, to Alaska, getting into Europe, and experiencing all the amazing things. Everyone kept asking me, oh, you you wanna go to the Super Bowl. Right? I'm like, well, maybe, maybe not. It's so nice to see it at home on television, but had a chance to go to a lot of amazing live sporting events. And there's nothing like being there, but, you know, maybe not for all the money. Eric [00:06:26]: Right? David Millili [00:06:26]: Yeah. We'll talk about later with the service fee I paid, though. Watch the Eagles lose. Anyway, what's what's the secret talent you have that people don't know about? Eric [00:06:35]: Well, I'm a singer and a barbershop harmony enthusiast. I've been learning to play the piano after the pandemic started. I thought, why not give it a go? But, yeah, I'm I I love singing, love live music, for a reason, and part of that is hearing just great vocals together. David Millili [00:06:52]: So now this last question, if you had a time machine, are you going back in time or into the future? And what year do you wanna go to? Eric [00:07:00]: Wow. I mean, it's a really tough one. In our business, the future is going to be replaced by robots in what, another 36 months. So let's let's just stay let's stay where we are. Let's definitely not go back to the pandemic. Steve Carran [00:07:15]: I think Eric [00:07:16]: the the the best part of my career was just on the way up, enjoying the thrill of our business and and having wonders be there. But, how about the the middle 2000 when the economy was really kicking butt and before all the politics started taking over every part of our day? Why not? Steve Carran [00:07:35]: That's great. I'm not sure I wanna go back to high school, but not a bad answer. David Millili [00:07:39]: Yeah. We're a little old. Steve Carran [00:07:40]: So that was great. Now we're gonna get more into your your background, a little bit what makes you tick. So, Eric, where did you grow up? Eric [00:07:50]: I'm a Midwestern man from the Detroit suburbs in Michigan, and, you know, learned how to connect with people, have conversations, and and where your handshake is your bond, delivering on your promises, all the just amazing things of yesteryear. Steve Carran [00:08:07]: Absolutely. I'm from Wisconsin, so same thing. And John's a Michigan guy as well. Besides kinda, you know, that handshake is your bond, how did that shape who you are today? Eric [00:08:17]: You know, one of the biggest surprises for me when I moved, after graduating high school, I moved to Orlando, Florida. And Florida is such a great melting pot, but at that time, there was more people would tell you something and just not follow through. I didn't really understand what that was even about. Right? It was a little alien concept to me, but it was a big eye opener in just how I how I when I say I'm going to deliver on any sort of whether it's financial results, scheduled appointments, meetings, you know, making sure that we not only deliver, but also bring quality to the experience, trying your best, delivering on excellence. I I believe those things were all shaped growing up in that Midwest culture. It's just phenomenal. David Millili [00:09:00]: So you went to college at the University of Central Florida. Go nice. You majored in you majored in psychology majored in psychology. What made you choose to go that route when you went into to college? Eric [00:09:11]: Well, psychology careers are interesting. I knew that I didn't wanna be a clinical psychologist, but part of UCF's undergraduate program required you to take a careers in psychology course. And I'll never forget going to the library and taking the VHS tapes out, putting them in, and many of the business leaders that were being interviewed, it's a 1 credit hour course, said that I would rather put a psychologist in my business than an a business major or an MBA because businesses are all about people. So at that point, that was freshman year, I took that course and shifted. I added a business minor to my course work and said, okay. There's gotta be an end game here. I can't just go into psychology and learn all about people, which is absolutely critical in the hospitality business. But that business acumen really did from accounting to marketing and just, you know, getting into the nuts and bolts of what businesses take to operate, I really feel like that people business growing up in the Midwest led me to use that skill every single day, whether I was coming up as a line employee, a new manager, a director, a leader of leaders, all of those things really led me to use the psychology skills and our clinical, I'm sorry, physiological psychology professor, Doctor Brophy, at UCF taught us how to juggle. Eric [00:10:43]: And he was really a phenomenal psychologist, but he said, I'm gonna teach you what it's like to learn a new skill and I want you to be able to graduate in 20 years from now, have something that you remember other than the book was blue in my class. And I think about all the amazing psychology content that we had to pour through, but, I can still juggle. It's phenomenal. Steve Carran [00:11:07]: Have you ever tried juggling while running? Eric [00:11:10]: Oh, once or twice, but not not very often. Steve Carran [00:11:14]: We had we had a guest on that that was his thing. He would juggle and run. So he would run marathons while juggling. So had to ask on that one. David Millili [00:11:21]: That's funny. So you're the coauthor of Sell More Stress Less, 52 Tips to Become a Mindful Sales Professional. Can you talk about how sales can both inspire the salespeople and the prospects and just tell us more about the book? Eric [00:11:35]: Yeah. Thanks, David. In the height of my professional sales career at Walt Disney World, World, I won an award in 2018, and it was one of those years where I hadn't hit my numbers, like, on a monthly basis, on a quarterly basis, but I had a lot of really great prospects. The previous year, I hit, like, 80% or 85% because it was that 1 or 2 deals to get me to the promised land that just didn't sign by the end of the year. Well, in 2018, on Thursday at 3:45 PM, one day, 1 hour, and 15 minutes prior to the fiscal year ending, I received a contract that took me from a similar type of year to the top sales award for 2018. And I had that next hour and 15 minutes and one Friday to enjoy the just relief of knowing that I had achieved my goal. I was in a really good position. There were all the things that were going to come with achieving that success. Eric [00:12:38]: But Monday, the following Monday, everything reset back to 0. And I knew that in anticipation of receiving my goals for the next year, that those goals were going to go up. And frankly, it took me 4 years to get that one contract the Thursday before the last fiscal day of the year. And I really didn't know what I was gonna do to get to that next level. I didn't have a chance to really enjoy it. I was really freaking out. But when you talk about sales and how our career has its highs and lows, There's that no tree grows to the sky mentality that many organizations don't bring to the table. They're burning our our sales professionals out and salespeople in general are highly competitive by nature. Eric [00:13:24]: However, we're not really taught how to go about our day without stressing ourselves out, being overwhelmed, and then affecting our own personal health, affecting our relationships at work and at home. My collaborator, Holly Duckworth, and I were speaking on opposite ends of the country on 2 very different things. I was speaking on sales, partnerships, associations, contracting, how we could all be better players in that field. Holly was speaking on how to take your chaos, bring it to calm, and be more effective as a mindful leader. And we compared notes and before you you knew it, we said, I think we've got some really good ideas here. Sales people need to know about this, but they're not gonna pick up a book and read something that just teaches them how to relax. Let's give them sales strategies and how in 52 weeks they can take their game to the next level. If you're a new professional in sales, if you've been doing this for a long time and you're looking for that new inspiration. Eric [00:14:23]: So we sat down, put those notes on paper, released it in December of 2019, just in time for the pandemic. And we'll be celebrating 5 years of that content, speaking around the world about it, and it's it's phenomenal. Steve Carran [00:14:35]: Awesome. That's awesome. So you've mentioned this before. You're also a choral musical performer as well. You enjoy singing. How did how did you get into that, and when did you realize that that was one of your passions? Eric [00:14:48]: That was a high school referral. You know, we all take general courses, but, had some guidance into getting into music performance. And over the years, I actually dropped out of anything after college. I didn't really perform. You know, you get into the workplace. You you karaoke every now and again, but we're not gonna go into that. But I ran into a great buddy of mine who said, what I I asked him what he did, and he said, you know, I I meet on Tuesday nights and we we sing as a chorus with with a bunch of professionals and we work through barbershop harmony. And I thought, that's really a thing? So I I went in, believe it or not, have competed with the Barbershop Harmony Society based out of Nashville, Tennessee. Eric [00:15:32]: This is an international organization with doctors, lawyers, professionals of high advanced degrees that are performing, and we had a chance to go to conventions about this sort of thing. When I worked for Disney, Disney puts on the candlelight processional in Orlando at Epcot. Every year between Thanksgiving and New Year's, I had a chance to perform as a part of the cast choir at Walt Disney World, one of the very few unknown benefits that you have in putting on your show. I worked in a sales role at Walt Disney World, but I had a chance to perform in that and met celebrities from Neil Patrick Harris to Edward James, almost half the princess voices and, you know, many celebrities that are that are come in to do those things. And it's just getting a chance to perform at any level is is something that is truly rewarding for me, and I just enjoy it. Steve Carran [00:16:24]: Love it. What's your favorite song to sing in a barbershop quartet? Eric [00:16:27]: Well, in a barbershop quartet, the Music Man is what I originally started in. So you've got things like lighter rose and many of the classics, but you'd be amazed at how how that music really does permeate. And there's a song you'll hear at a commercial or something. You're like, oh, yeah. That's old barbershop too. You know? Steve Carran [00:16:45]: That's awesome. That's great. So now we're gonna dive into more the career, how you got to where you are today. So you started, as you said, at the Peabody, but then you got into conference services side of things. But then you went to Hilton to become a GM, then Marriott where you were the director of sales and marketing. What made you make that switch from the conference side of things to the sales and marketing? I understand there's overlap, but, you know, it seems like you really started to focus on sales and marketing once you to Marriott. What made you go through that change? Eric [00:17:19]: Well, when I first got into the industry, left the restaurant world and got my degree, I started as a conference service manager. My neighbor referred me to an 800 room hotel near Universal Studios in Orlando, Florida. And conference services was not necessarily an entry level position, but this this property had seen its better days. It was a little bit older, and there weren't a lot of people lining up to go work there. So when I applied for the job and was hired, I was able to get into 30 to 50 events per week that I was servicing. This was a volume hotel and a crash course in how to service, a conference from, you know, executing banquet event orders to billing, getting all of the logistics together. But director of sales, Linda Wyman, I know you're out there, Linda. Hi. Eric [00:18:12]: How are you? Said, at some point, you're gonna start in services, but I'll get you over to sales and when you're ready, just let me know. It took me about 5 years to make that change. I went to work at the Swan and Dolphin after volunteering in the local NACE chapter as programs committee chair and, my co chair was a catering manager at the Swan and Dolphin, huge convention box property managed by Starwood at the time, on property right next to Epcot. So I transitioned, spent the first two years at that property near Universal Studios, the next three at the Swan and Dolphin, really honing in on professionalism and this business servicing what salespeople were selling, so delivering on the nightmare after the dream was sold. And I I felt like after 5 years of of truly understanding how customers wanted the conferences to flow, didn't matter if it was a meeting for a corporation, for the government, for any sort of association. You and how you could deliver on those things was the foundation I had before I ever stepped into a sales office. Steve Carran [00:19:17]: I have a follow-up question kind of on the conference services side of things. With that much volume, And that being almost your first time in a role like that mistakes had to happen. Were there any mistakes that you made where you're like, this is it for me, but turned out to be just a great learning experience? Eric [00:19:35]: You might I was just telling the story last week, you know, because we have the wonderful CAD drawings, you know, back this is the late nineties when you would need to draw a diagram. We had a stencil kit that had crescent rounds and banquet rounds and all the different half moons and banquet tables. I I would love walking into my banquet manager's office and showing what I was proposing to put into a 2,000 square foot room or a 15,000 square foot room, and just having her look at me and laugh and say, you really don't understand the space time continuum. This would never fit in this room. This is, you know, way more there's there's fire marshal regulation. So I think every day I would learn something new in that role. And my office was co shared with the director of conference services, and my leader was sitting next to me. He knew I was green and hungry. Eric [00:20:32]: And he said, he said, anytime you have a question, ask me. So we had conversations all day, every day. And I I just soaked it up. I learned as much as I could in that role, and it was just a great launching pad for that next level and for taking me into, you know, my career. David Millili [00:20:49]: At Disney, you were the senior sales manager. You were the top salesperson. So what have you learned what did you learn back then that helps you in your current role? Eric [00:20:58]: Disney is before I even joined the organization as a full time salaried cast member, I was a a guest of Disney. I worked as Good Neighbor Hotels and collaborated very much to drive business, whether it was leisure heavily or meetings and conventions. So learning how Disney operated, we say pulling back the curtain and learning the business behind the magic, how strategic and intentional every part of that organization is from top to bottom, and how the customer experience is designed to walk in at a very high level. The leadership excellence and the customer experience side from an employee engagement is really what has laid the foundation of my career. And prior to joining, Disney as a senior sales manager, that was after my director of sales career with all of those brands we mentioned. And in college, I even started as a server at the Contemporary Resorts. So that was my 2nd stint at Disney, coming back to them after leaving in college and going to work in those other organizations, being trained as a salesperson and a director of sales in those other organizations. I can tell you Disney is second to none on how the onboarding process delivers such quality to you. Eric [00:22:23]: It took almost a year for me to really be trained as a Disney cast member, and I use that every single day back then and today. I mean, it's just unbelievable how you you look at a theme park or a cartoon or an animated feature or whatever it is thinking, oh, this isn't serious. This is for kids or this is for people who just needed a break from life. But the business side of that does lead every decision. And you can't just walk in with your ego, like many of us do, and say, I've arrived, and I'm here to change everything. If you walk in the door at Disney as the individual who's bigger, better, smarter, you're not gonna last very long. You really are a part of a complex organization. You're part of a team. Eric [00:23:08]: And, like, a movie, for example, if you're the person holding the microphone, you're not the lead actor. Or if you're the person behind the camera or if you're the director, you play your role. When I sold meetings and conventions at Disney, I played my role, and I did it very, very well. And winning that award was a goal I set in 2011 when I joined the organization. It took me till 2018 to get there. I thought it would I'd have it in 3 years, but it's not easy. And a little bit of luck comes into play, those timings of the contracts coming in. Just because you want it doesn't necessarily mean that Disney is going to allow you to place that piece of business because you're competing against every other traveler to fill the room at the right price. Eric [00:23:52]: So you're fulfilling the obligations of the shareholders. I mean, it really is humbling, and at the same time, being the best at your craft is just rewarding and relieving at the same time. Steve Carran [00:24:04]: I love that. And now you are the director of sales on the business intelligence side at Amadeus. Tell us about the current role and kind of what your focus is there. Eric [00:24:13]: Yeah. When I knew it was time to leave the hotel proper as far as on property, above property, regional, area director, I knew I wanted to go work remote. I was moving to Denver, Colorado. The first call I made was one of my vendors, it's TravelClick. And at the time, TravelClick being acquired by Amadeus. They were acquiring new market. And they were having a very hard time filling this role because not a lot of people they were putting out in the interview world understood what business intelligence was, especially in the hospitality industry. They said to the recruiter, you know, I'm a bit of a unicorn here because not only do I understand it, I believe in it, and I've used it every single day of my career to drive the right decisions when it comes to achieving revenue goals. Eric [00:24:59]: And what I do at North America is I connect with, it doesn't matter if you're an independent hotel branded, large, small. I have a variety of working in all markets in North America. So I have a chance to to sit down, talk to whether it's an ownership group, management company, general manager, revenue leader, sales leader, really align your goals with achieving top line revenue strategies. And, of course, those data driven strategies that you're going to use to be successful in your organization are the conversations I'm most passionate about. David Millili [00:25:35]: You were also the cofounder of American Mindfulness Association, which is dedicated to incorporating mental health and well-being in the corporate sector. Can you tell us more about that initiative? Eric [00:25:47]: Yeah. Thanks for asking, David. The American Mindfulness Association is an idea that my cofounder Holly and I, also coauthor of the book, really decided as a passion project to drive wellness, not just in the hospitality industry, but when we talk about wellness, we're partners with Merit's Global Events, part of their well-being initiatives. Many times you think about wellness, let's just stay in the hospitality zone. We're talking about a fun run at a conference. We're talking about the fitness center, making sure that the water and amenities and restaurants and menus are are healthy. It's not just about the donut breaks and, you know, putting food and fuel together. This is taking your mental wellness to the next level. Eric [00:26:31]: We wanna make sure that we're sustaining high performance all day long. And if we talk about the American Mindfulness Association, we are pulling leaders across industries, not just the hospitality industry, but think the American Psychological Association has many different branches on that tree. The American Medical Association, American Dental Association. This is taking the practice in a business context of using the right mindset to drive your business results. And whether it's using technology for this, whether it's the humanity part of AI or having the right mindset being fully present in your business conversations so that you can drive the right results. The American Mindfulness Association is just getting started and we're looping together leaders in in the industry and the right goal is to provide education and networking opportunities and set some guidelines for those individuals. Steve Carran [00:27:31]: That's great. So now we're gonna move on to the last section here, industry thoughts, and get your opinion on a few things. So one question I had with your background is how can hotels utilize the data that they have to really drive drive better commercial strategies? Eric [00:27:51]: This is the the $1,000,000 question or sometimes the $1,000,000,000 question, Steve. It's about know, a lot of intuition based decisions that are made tend to perhaps not land in the space you think they are. So when we talk about current hotelier, if you're a revenue leader and how complex and dynamic quickly things change, the economy can change midday, multiple times a day in any market at any time. Well, how do you have the right news and data and insights to drive your strategies? If you're following Twitter or x or social media, which many great revenue leaders will do, you know, be aware of current events. That's just sometimes the headlines are part of the story. If you're attending industry events and you're networking and you're talking to other properties about business levels, clearly, you're gonna do that ethically and legally. Right? Because you can't have any sort of price fixing or collusion conversations out there in the industry, but there's just a lot of noise and garbage out there. If you're getting your data from the right source and you can now log into software, understand where the demand is for your market. Eric [00:29:06]: You are ahead of the game. It's gonna help you drive the right strategies and give you the best opportunity to drive the most revenue and RevPAR, profitable RevPAR to your ownership group and management group and achieve your goals. Every single day, we we speak with hoteliers who do not have those resources and they're frustrated, they're confused, they don't really understand why they're not achieving their goals. They're looking at historical data, they're looking at their own property year over year and trying to figure it out and that's one metric of your overall health, but there's so much more. And if you don't have the right data and you're not using the right insights to drive that data, From my perspective, you might get successful in this industry, but it's a lot more difficult and chances are more often than not, you're probably going to fail. David Millili [00:29:56]: Yeah. That's for me, you're, and for this show, you're speaking to the choir as we talk about music. That's that's exactly right. So you were a secret shopper at Universal CityWalk. What are the most common mistakes you've seen on the food food and beverage side, restaurant side, and what can they do to change some of those those things that you've seen? Eric [00:30:16]: Well, it's funny about that, and thank you for asking because we're we're bouncing back and forth a little bit here, but when it comes to the think about let's go back in our time machine. Right? You asked about that earlier. When I graduated in 1996 with my college degree, I chose Orlando, Florida as my career beginning destination because I knew from what I saw, the economy was poised to grow significantly. This was when Pleasure Island was still a thing in Orlando at Walt Disney World, which is now Disney Springs. It's completely evolved. There's no ticket price. There's no gate. It's open all day long with great retail and shopping, world class experiences. Eric [00:30:55]: But Universal Studios, there was one theme park back then and a huge parking lot with trams. Universal was landlocked, and they knew they needed to add something different to compete with not only the Pleasure Island, but capture additional revenue. And when they opened City Walk in the 2000, the interesting thing about that was you had a bunch of new restaurants, new retail establishments, but Universal didn't really know if the service levels were being delivered. And I'm talking about when you start, walk into a restaurant, how quickly are you greeted? How long does it take you to be served at the bar? Are you ordering and paying with cash? Are the bartenders ringing that up or pocketing it? Is there employee theft? There's so many different ways you can look at it. Is the food good? Are the drinks good? I had a chance using my restaurant experience and training to be a guest and try to the best of my ability and very successfully to avoid getting caught taking notes on all of those things, delivering a report, and giving a chance for all of the restaurants that were coming online at that point to be better and delivering the right experience, not only for the guest, but for, of course, the ownership and the stakeholders. Right? David Millili [00:32:13]: That's great. And in 2019, you presented a keynote on how to create an authentic world class customer experience. What advice can you give to hotels based off of that? Eric [00:32:24]: Yeah. And what you're leaving out of that question, David, is that was delivered in South Africa to the South African Association For Convention Industry at their annual congress, and I was contacted by their planning committee and Peter Swartz from South Africa. Initially, I thought I might be getting even at that point, I thought, am I getting cyber hacked here? Is someone inviting me to go to South Africa? But they really want me to send $10,000 to them and, you know, have something and, you know, I'm not getting scammed. But to my delight, I was able to use my global resources to validate that this actually is a valid request. And they wanted really to learn more about the culture and how Americans were delivering that, whether it was the Disney culture or the the brands that I worked for. And the best part about that contract negotiation was I said, I'm more than willing to share this insight, but I can't share anything from those brands that you mentioned because that's all proprietary information. And so we sat down and collaborated on how to create an authentic world class customer experience. And I drew from that Peabody Orlando training. Eric [00:33:39]: I drew from the Disney culture. My take on where you could infuse incredible and amazing guest experiences. And what's great about that is I also use content from the customer experience Professionals Association, the CXPA, which has 6 tenants on how you can teach this. And I didn't just get on stage and tell a bunch of funny stories about how I thought you should do it. I went to where the experts were and I used the CXPA content as the foundation of the talk and brought in just amazing strategies and one of those was taught on Safari in South Africa where I've actually brought that content and that story into IMAX in 2019 as well in Las Vegas, where we were staying at a 5 Diamond Resort in South Africa and getting up every morning at dawn and at sunset and getting into jeeps and going on safari to go see animals in the wild in this beautiful nature reserve. And on the last day of our stay, we had our guide drive up to said we're gonna go have a special stop today. And they stopped us at what they called the champagne tree. And we're like, what is a champagne tree? How do you grow champagne from a tree? And they tied a swing, 2 pieces of rope and a board to a tree and waiting for us were mimosas, freshly chilled champagne, orange juice, and absolute crystal glassware. Eric [00:35:15]: And we thought, you know, here we are in the middle of this outdoor wilderness, and there's many amazing things that we had, that safari experience at the Leopard Mountain Lodge in South Africa, which if you have a chance to go, I highly recommend it. But think about what it took to deliver that. Someone had to get up before we did, go out in the middle of a random spot, collaborate it, have chilled fresh orange juice and champagne, and it was the the cherry on top of unbelievable experience. We talked about, you know, the the champagne mimosa tree and how you can deliver an authentic you can't get that anywhere else. I mean, you could sure. You could put sparkling something and and orange juice on a buffet, but, you know, how do you take advantage of this? Make it unbelievably incredible, and how you can take that to your organization and deliver on incredible results. And just because you have, you know, new brick and mortar or brand new shiny pennies, that doesn't mean you're gonna have a great customer experience. There's ways you can do that. Eric [00:36:17]: And guess what? In South Africa, they have many of the same challenges and questions that we have in North America. It's not a different people with different expectations. Everyone's looking for that wonderful authentic experience. And, I had the pleasure of delivering that to the amazing leaders in South Africa, and I can't wait to go back and see them again. Steve Carran [00:36:37]: Awesome. So last question here before we we move on. But, one thing for our hoteliers out there, what are ways that the rest of the folks in the hotel can collaborate with, you know, the folks on the sales and marketing side to really drive more revenue growth in the hotel. Eric [00:36:58]: Yeah, Steve. You're talking about commercial strategy. So if we're in an island and we're siloed as sales leaders, as revenue leaders, operations leaders, all of the employees that flow through the financial statements. I can tell you that one, everything is connected. And if we use the adage, and and I don't wanna sound too stereotypical, but let's just use a couple for fun. So you can't take ADR to the bank. Right? I have a great ADR. I'm just star in the ADR department. Eric [00:37:31]: Well, how many rooms did you sell at that ADR? Like, 4. Okay. Well, how many rooms are in your hotel? 500. Okay. Congratulations. You're you're not doing yourself a service by even talking about this. And, oh, by the way, if you're sold out all the time, but your Hotelier losing money, you're on the opposite end of that scheme. You know? I have a horrible rate, but I'm bringing in all this revenue. Eric [00:37:56]: Well, are you bringing in the right revenue? Are you bringing in revenue that is going to make your ownership group happy, that's gonna sustain your business so that people are employed. And I take the responsibility very seriously as a sales and revenue leader that it's not just about me. We're we're responsible for housekeeping, engineering, food and beverage, front desk, operations, anyone in the building, vendors in the community having the opportunity for economic development. And you see, like, in today's news, you know, the city of Oakland, California. I spoke kind of during Dreamforce Salesforce 2 years ago to the hotel community there, and they were asking me, like, what's happening right now in my Q4? I don't really see the business coming in that we used to. I said, well, as a hotelier, I I do empathize with you because you're losing huge demand generators. That was when the Raiders left for Las Vegas. I said you need to call Al Davis and ask him why he left your community, and that's just a start. Eric [00:38:59]: And that was after, you know, you have professional sports leaving and sadly, you know, the last kind of nugget, the the professional baseball team has chose to go to Sacramento for 3 years and then to Las Vegas. And you feel for that community. You think about, well, what went wrong there? How did we say as a talk track? And I'm not trying to be judgmental here that, oh, we're not gonna support these billionaires by giving them tax dollars. Well, I can tell you in Orlando, we were unified in the business community. The mayor of Orlando, who's been there for a very long time, Buddy Dyer, the mayor of Orange County, the business leader community understood the value of bringing together the top business leaders with the top universities like UCF and industry taking those collaborative efforts to drive economic revenue into the community. And I see great examples of that around North America and the US and Canada and how those economic drivers are positive, but they are also decisions that have opportunity costs and and you feel for those employees when when you talk about your individual business. And if revenue management, sales, and operations have an alignment and then you go outside the business and to your community, everything that is connected to drive those demand generators are what will make you successful. So when I think about a hotel, I don't just look at the year over year variances. Eric [00:40:27]: I don't think about, is it group or transient mix that's coming in? What segments are booking? Is it, you know, corporate negotiated rates that are coming in, or is it really more of those retail bar rates? We wanna do everything we can to just book as many rooms at an unqualified discount so that we can just count our money and laugh all the way to the bank, but it's just not that simple. And we talk about how if if you're a destination and you're collaborating effectively, how that impacts your tax dollars, how that improves the community. It's all connected. So there's an obligation there. In Orlando, I served for 6 years as part of the convention sales committee. Ways to collaborate as a community to drive the right business in at the right time so that we could be an effective, thriving, healthy business community. So as a business, as I tell you, 1st and foremost, yes, you have an obligation to deliver those results, but you really wanna make sure that you're thinking longer term, not for those quick wins. And if your revenue sales and operations teams have a relationship that is not good, let's just say, Work on that. Eric [00:41:39]: Start breaking down those silos. Bring those relationships together. I remember many revenue leaders where we didn't just see each other at the Rev Max meeting and take out our, you know, swords and metaphorically fight over what we thought was the right decision. We had conversations outside of those meetings. We did go to happy hours and try to have more of a relationship than just that, you know, what are we doing to set the right strategy for the day? So I know that may be a little pie in the sky, but the end of the day, I think there's a lot of of wisdom that I've learned through mentorship over the years, and I've tried to be a positive influencer on those changes. So it's challenging out there. When when you look at the competition today for your dollar as a hotelier, every different brand variable, every independent nuance that's out there, and how you differentiate yourself through commercial strategy, the winners of that game are are dynamic. They're flexible. Eric [00:42:37]: They're creative, and they approach each day with that curiosity and how they can learn to be more effective. And you're not just rigid in setting yourself up for failure every day by saying, well, I finally figured that out. I don't have to change anything. I'll just I'll do this, and that's my goal for the rest of the year. It doesn't work that way. It's why we love this business. Right? Steve Carran [00:42:56]: That's right. That was great. Awesome. Well, perfect. So now we're gonna we have 2 more segments. This time, we've been asking you questions this whole episode. So now you get the opportunity to ask us one question. Eric [00:43:09]: Just one? Just one. I mean, David, you're you're an independent, passionate leader in this business. I know it breaks your heart every time you see, you know, someone acquire a brand and go into a conglomeration. It does break my heart a little bit. What do you find is your secret for making sure that doesn't happen? I mean, right now in this economy, how do you stay as unique and thriving as an individual property right now? David Millili [00:43:40]: We talked about this on our hot topics episode. I think it's just it's gonna be a losing battle just because of the economics of it. I mean, back in the day, when I first you know, growing up in hospitality, I was worked every job and I moved to New York and it was you know, I I took the independent route because I didn't wanna have to follow the brand levels of having to do this then do that. I wanted to control my own destiny. And I think, unfortunately, it's gotten to the point where the dollars control it. And you see these brands that are great. You know, the graduate story, you know, time will tell, but what I've felt is over the years is that even though they still excel, even brands like Kimpton have lost some of their edge because they've been gobbled up. And so I don't think there's a good answer because I think we're in a great space. David Millili [00:44:34]: People love to travel. People love hotels. And I think as these independent hotels become more popular, the dollar signs are just too difficult for the ownership to turn their their back and walk away from it. And I think that's a shame. But, you know, I hope that, you know, it's like when you, you know, you leave your kids built up to. But there's many others that have come and gone as independents. So, again, I just think the dollars are too difficult right now to when you start to get a group of hotels, it's too difficult. Eric [00:45:09]: You know, what's fascinating about that, and, first of all, I think Hilton's gonna be just fine. I think they're they're gonna be able to figure it out. But you look at if we look back at a couple acquisitions that may not have gone as well as they could have, you think about Marriott taking over Gaylord Properties, and here's here's what I learned. I I started with Starwood Hotels. I went to Hilton, and then I went to Marriott after that. And what I was dumbfounded and also impressed by, I know that's a bit of a conundrum, was how Marriott comes in and tells you how great they are and how they're going to do it because they're Marriott, and they do it. And they recruited me and hired me from Hilton in Orlando because of how great I was, and I came in and was taught just how ungrade I was, evidently, because I didn't know every little nuance that Marriott was doing. But the funny part about that was Marriott said, you know, we we know big box convention hotels. Eric [00:46:02]: We're a leader in this industry, so we're gonna come in and apply our model to Gaylord. Well, Gaylord is super successful at what they did. And I don't know how much you know about this, but Merit, from my perspective and many of those who were very close into that, really did not put the right model in place and started breaking Gaylord to the point where they had to back off and let Gaylord be who they are. And when you think about all the amazing standardization that brands can do in this world of personalization and playing to your strengths and those independent properties that have so much great value for the local culture, for their own independent, you know, uniqueness that travelers are looking for. There are many lessons to be learned in that in that space. And I I always look back at that Gaylord, and I think about that experience going, you know, just because you run large convention box properties your way and have been successful and delivered exceptional results does not mean you can take that and plug that in anywhere you go. So you really have to understand what the culture looks like, and I'm talking about staffing models. Now when you say, oh, here's what a staffing looks like for this size property, for the front desk, for operations. Eric [00:47:11]: Gaylord needed to do it their way, and I think they've they've found some common ground there. But they had to definitely learn from each other. And graduates and Hilton, I think, are gonna be fine, but that's just my take. Time will tell, like you said. Steve Carran [00:47:22]: I think that's a the personalization and the experience is what's gonna, you know, drive that independent from a brand. And I think we just need somebody that isn't in it for the money, who wants to maybe build a legacy or, you know, have a have their their identity being this brand that is gonna be solely independent. But that's just my take. But now John's been listening this whole time. So he has one final question for you, Eric. Alright. Jon Bumhoffer [00:47:46]: As a former GM and now a sales leader, I'm curious what you would tell hoteliers, owners, GMs to kinda help them support their sales teams to hit the revenue goals and then just, overall, just elevate the value that they bring to the property. Eric [00:48:02]: And I'll summarize it as quickly as I can. It's hard to staff a hotel these days. It's always been a challenge, but now more than ever, a general manager whose primary goals are really looking to not only ensure the success across the operation and the accountability is so, like, the the buck stops typically with your general manager, but making sure you understand those commercial strategies and that sales and marketing isn't just about the parties and the fun and the the, you know, the cool stuff that everyone thinks that is out there. And on the flip side of that, with sales, we're we're so trained to be rewarded and achieve goals. And at all costs, we just have to be successful. Well, that success doesn't just land with you achieving top line revenue. So that collaborative effort and understanding what impact you're going to have by bringing a piece of business to the hotel at any level. When I think about some of the general manager aspects, best practices, if you're I took over from a micromanager who literally had to respond to any guest complaint personally, which negatively impacted customer service scores. Eric [00:49:14]: And I thought this is a easy one for me. When I first took over, I spoke to the staff and I said, listen. I don't have enough time to do all of those things. You know I I trust you. I enable you. Make the right compensation to the guest in the moment if something goes wrong. And if you have a question, work with leaders, call me. We can certainly work through it. Eric [00:49:37]: If you make a mistake, I'm not gonna berate you over this. We'll talk about it and just we'll work towards not making that mistake again from an employee, you know, performance management standpoint, from a customer experience, and a guest compensation standpoint. And guess what? Within a week, the guest service scores skyrocketed. We didn't compensate. The guests didn't give away the or sorry. The employees didn't give away the farm. So the last piece I just I will say is empowering your team, trusting them for who they are. If you're paranoid about the, abilities of them to deliver on the service, 1, why did you hire them in the first place? 2, check yourself as a leader and say, alright. Eric [00:50:15]: Let's let's trust that we've done our job here. And if it if the whole thing fails, let's learn from it and move forward in a positive direction. But when you're out there, doesn't matter if you're a branded hotel, if you're independent, large, small, full service, non full service. Most management entities, brands, franchisors think they have the secret that can be done better than anyone else. Well, here's the good news. It's all the same game. So be the best that you can to deliver on your revenue targets. Make sure you have the right critiques when you're doing things right so that if something doesn't go right for a specific financial period, you have the ability to defend the decisions that were made because as much as we know think we know the future, no one has a crystal ball. Eric [00:51:06]: And just because you are planning to go see this beautiful eclipse doesn't mean that the clouds are gonna come in and ruin that whole experience for you. So, you you know, no one can really predict the future, and we do our best to do that. And, you know, just trust trust your your team. Know that it's not just about any one of those operational or sales or revenue organizations. It's about the holistic entity of the business, and then you're gonna be okay. David Millili [00:51:34]: That's great. Well, we appreciate it, Eric. That does it for another episode of the Modern Hotelier. This is where you get to tell people how they can find out more about Amadeus, how they can connect with you so you can plug away at this point. Eric [00:51:48]: Well, amadeus hospitality.com is where you'll find all of the products and resources that are part of the Hotelier ecosystem. So it's not just about the business intelligence, although, you know, I do like focusing on that because it's where I spend most of my time, but I'm just as connected with every one of our sellers in the industry. We work diligently every single day to make sure that the right products and right insights are there for you. Now I don't wanna get too pitchy. So at the end of the day, you you can find me on LinkedIn. I'm happy to connect with you and, you know, the industry at large. It's an amazing industry. I love this business. Eric [00:52:29]: Dedicated my career to it, and I can't wait to see. I get excited about what the, you know, summer is going to look like with the Olympics internationally, what travel's going to look like, and let's do it together. We're we're we're here. You're never alone. That's the other piece. When I first was promoted into these roles, I always thought, oh my gosh. Nobody is here to help me. Oh, yeah. Eric [00:52:49]: There are so many great resources out there, and and we're here to help. So reach out to me or any of the counterparts at Amadeus. It's an amazing organization, and, we wish you the best of luck in how we can partner to achieve your goals. David Millili [00:53:02]: That's great. So that does it for another episode of the Modern Hotelier. So whether you're watching or listening, we appreciate you, and we hope to be with you again soon. Thank you. Steve Carran [00:53:12]: You made it to the end of the Modern Hotelier. Thanks for listening. 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